UTMC

http://www.geekosystem.com/frank-buckle ... eran-dies/

Robert Quigley on geekosystem.com wrote:In 1917, a 16-year-old named Frank Buckles, repeatedly rejected for enlistment because he was underage, managed to convince the Army to let him fight in World War I. 84 years later, following a long life that included a stint as a POW in The Phillipines during World War II and a prominent role advocating a national World War I memorial later in life, Buckles has died at the age of 110.

12 million dead, military incompetence that will be remembered forever, a generation very nearly wiped out entirely, a single, continent-wide machine for killing people for no purpose...and quite soon, no one will be alive to remember it. And mankind, it seems, still hasn't learned a damn thing.

Gives me a weird feeling.

Godspeed, Mr. Buckles, and thanks.

--Jaeger

Not to talk smack about veterans or anything, but I like how they call the group of people that participated in the two biggest wars to date "The Greatest Generation". Although I guess there aren't any more of them now.

Thank You.

12 million dead, military incompetence that will be remembered forever

DG,

I would argue that is was more political incompetence.

110? Well, he was just asking for it, wasn't he?

Bestguess wrote:

12 million dead, military incompetence that will be remembered forever

DG,

I would argue that is was more political incompetence.

No, the politicians knew exactly what they were doing, they wanted that war.
The military commanders who sent wave after wave of their men over the top and into the machinegun fire, who'd send ten thousand men to die to capture literally only a few feet, they were who I was referring to.

The Great War is interesting because for probably the first time ever, nobody knew how to make war anymore. Tragically, it didn't stop them from trying.

I can understand the weird feeling. This last American solder dieing from WWI gives it to me. The rapidly dwindling numbers of WWII veterans does the same. The fact that Vietnam veterans are now the age I remember WWII veterans. The realization that most of my current college classmates were the same age I was during Gulf War 1 when 9/11 happened and I was active duty in the Marines. There is also the eerie realization that in my lifetime WWII will have happened 100 year ago, much like the American Civil War was to the veterans of WWII.

DerGolgo wrote:

Bestguess wrote:

12 million dead, military incompetence that will be remembered forever

DG,

I would argue that is was more political incompetence.

No, the politicians knew exactly what they were doing, they wanted that war.
The military commanders who sent wave after wave of their men over the top and into the machinegun fire, who'd send ten thousand men to die to capture literally only a few feet, they were who I was referring to.

I am going to have to agree with Bestguess that military competence or lack there of was not the issue at fault. Sending men to die to gain ground, even when numbered in the thousands, is the only way wars are fought, this is true if it is a trench 10 feet away or a strong hold 10,000 miles away. The military knows, to the point of embracing and glorifying death for country, the only way to end a war is to destroy the enemy, they also know it costs lives, and without a doubt it is with a heavy heart that they send men into harms way (at times not to return) to do these deeds. Every war is always started with the last wars tactics, in this case the tools of war had improved enough to make the old tactics not just dated, but dated to the point of noteworthy results. Politicians also know the cost of war, even if publicly they deny it to keep their hands clean. To dump all blame on the military commanders is just plain wrong. It is true there was a long bloody stalemate, but if one side was to leave they would have been the losers. I am sure there is the quaint pacifist thought of "What if there was a war and no one showed up?" sadly in most cases, to include this one, someone has already showed up.

In a hope to try to get this back on track and show some respect for the dead I will post this:

<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/yK9TDt3Ouo4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I've been reading about the Great War for a few years now, and although every book details every event, big and small, none of them can make any sense out of why it happened. If by chance they shed a little light on why events fell on each other like dominoes, it still only spells out the how. I wish our world leaders were better historians than lawyers.

Salute to you Mr. Buckles, gods speed.

I wasn't trying to shove all the blame on the military commanders.
What I was referring to are the tactics employed, for instance, by the Royal Army.
Have all your men climb out of their trench and walk, side by side in a wide line, right into the line of fire of two German machine-gun emplacements.
And do it again, and again, and again, and again.

I think the reasons behind the whole tragedy had more to do with a complex change of situation. French soldiers went to the front just like napoleonian soldiers, proud, standing and in lines... then had to face different weapons, different strategies, and their military habits were outdated. The gap between their "expectation" as they left paris on a train labelled "A Berlin" or left berlin on a train labelled "nacht paris" sure to be back for chistmas and the reality of the conflict is to blame.
The shock that followed changed society, the same way WWII changed society once it became clear that war meant no longer fighting soldiers but also killing innocent civilians as a intentional strategy . We can only hope that the next step will be a step back from barbarism and that the next conflicts will only involve machines controlled by highly specialised personal on a remote location or concepts or involve non killing devices like this one
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... eapon.html
.
I wish education and media will continue to honour the memories of the war veterans just like the stories my grand mother used to tell me every sunday about resistance during WWII forged my view on humanity, but I doubt they will.

While not directly related, this thread seems like the most appropriate place to post this:

<iframe title="YouTube video player" width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/MQRpAxGVg4M" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

That vid made me smile on a number of levels, and I bet it'll make a bunch of you fuckers smile too.

Old Man STILL got some mad skillz.

[/threadjack]

--Jaeger