UTMC

I know I will regret this post but here it goes.

The trusty Box (honda element) is starting to show her age. Looking for suggestions for a replacement. In a perfect world I'd just buy a commuter and keep the Element for everything else. But I can only support 1 auto.

I'm curious to see what you yahoos suggest. These are my parameters:
Carry 4 adults and gear, 4WD/AWD, better than 25MPG highway.

I keep looking at the Mazda CX5, Subaru Crosstrek or Outback. Then get lured in to the BMW 528 or Cadillac ATS and CTS.

Rock wrote: I'm curious to see what you yahoos suggest. These are my parameters:
Carry 4 adults and gear, 4WD/AWD, better than 25MPG highway.

If you need to haul bikes, I'd say a Toyota Tacoma with an extended cab and the 2.7L engine.

If you're not trying to haul gear... I suppose a Subaru Outback or WRX or something.

Not much on the market that's 4x4 and gets millage that good. I'd recommend the Ridgeline, but my millage is absolute shit. (Otherwise it's been a great truck so far.)

Why not another Element?

--Jaeger

Wait for a 2013 Ford Fusion AWD. Mileage is TBD, but it's a bloomin two liter turbo with direct injection. Or a leftover Taurus, if you don't mind a bloated geriatric car.

The Infiniti G25x AWD just makes the cut at 19/27 mpg.

I just trailered about 800 pounds of shit across a third of the continent, still managed about 38mpg.

VW 1.9L TDI. W/o trailer, I get 49mpg. If I had my druthers I'd make it a Passat (more room) but we're little people.

If you can find a leftover '12 Ford escape hybrid, those are quite good small SUVs. They use a licensed variant of the Prius hybrid system, get really good mileage (particularly in the city) and several of my friends who have one have been quite pleased. They were discontinued after this model year so you might be able to get a deal on one.

I would suggest the Outback, except you are hard pressed to get above your 25mpg requirement. At least, we have been so far with ours. Otherwise, it is a kickass car/wagon.

If you have a pile of money you just can't stand keeping around any more, get the BMW. For decades their reliability numbers have been shit, and their commonly-needed parts have been much pricier (2x or worse) than the same part for other cars.

Have you considered putting snow tires on a Dodge Grand Caravan/Chrysler Town&Country (or a fucking VW Routan if you must)?? A two ton vehicle has plenty of traction, even without the standard electronic assistances.

Michael Karesh wrote:The revised minivan has precise, firm, perfectly weighted steering and tightly controlled body motions... feels smaller and lighter than it actually is...Pockmarked roads that have bedeviled most of the cars I’ve tested failed to faze this minivan. No pitch, no head toss, just level cruising regardless of the road surface.

Jack Baruth wrote:Very few drivers — and I mean very few — really want to go faster on a curvy road than the T&C can take them. I’m considering taking one to the infamous “Tail of the Dragon” and forcing sportbikers to give me the wave past.

Given the miles you put on cars driving up and down the east coast every weekend, I'd think about dropping the AWD requirement and looking at a Passat TDI, Acura TSX wagon, or some other car with better mileage and a nicer interior. In the case of the TDIs, 40+mpg seems to be the norm, and I've liked the interiors on the ones I've ridden in.

If you are stuck on the AWD/4WD, a Subaru WRX/Legacy/Outback/etc. would fit the bill, although you might be close on the mileage. Mitsubishi also offers the baby Evo / Ralliart as a hatch with the turbo motor and an automatic transmission, which I think you like. The price is probably good because they are desperate for customers these days. I liked my Evo X alright, but the mileage was more like 24-26mpg on the highway if I babied it.

The mid sized pick ups like the Tacoma, Frontier, etc. are nice, but the options can be weird. When I've looked, I have not been able to get cruise control on a low option model, and when you start ticking the 4WD, crew cab, etc. options you pretty quickly end up around 30k, which is full sized truck territory. A full sized truck would meet pretty much all your requirements, and with the right engine choice, some of them break 25mpg, have you thought about that?

I don't think the Element is still available, but the Ridgeline is pretty much an Element that can carry a motorcycle, so it might be even better.

The new Fusion looks very pretty, as does the ATS, but do you really want to buy a first year car? The CTS should be very solid by now, and if you feel like having it all you can get a CTS wagon with the 550hp motor and a stick.

hey rock, i sell hondas and mazdas.. the cx5 is titties.. the new crv is also titties. if you wanna go with either one, let me know.

... i would also look at a mazda 3. 40mpg, front wheel drive. and they are a pretty nice drive.

wzm wrote:I don't think the Element is still available, but the Ridgeline is pretty much an Element that can carry a motorcycle, so it might be even better.

I have a Ridgeline, and while I'm quite happy with it, it does NOT get good millage. I'm happy if I see 18-19mpg -- it's usually closer to 12-15.

--Jaeger

Jaeger wrote:

wzm wrote:I don't think the Element is still available, but the Ridgeline is pretty much an Element that can carry a motorcycle, so it might be even better.

I have a Ridgeline, and while I'm quite happy with it, it does NOT get good millage. I'm happy if I see 18-19mpg -- it's usually closer to 12-15.

--Jaeger

I had a friend with a 4WD Element, and it wasn't that much better.

I thought about this more Rock, and what Rev says is completely correct. You are almost always making solo trips. Do you really need or want a new car or truck? Repair the Element as stuff breaks, and drive it into the ground. The used car market is insane right now due to not enough cars getting sold over the last three-four years, and new cars have also gone up in cost. Do you really want $30-35,000 in car debt (or even just $35,000 out of your wallet)? I know you could get away with "only" 20-25k on a Subaru, but the ATS, CTS, etc. are not going to be that way.

A tiny fraction of that will keep the Element fixed up (or replace the entire driveline and interior), and leave you with tons of money left over for dates with the elderly ladies at your apartment, motorcycle trips to California/Colorado/Canada, or like 10 more of your college student special Ducati 900 SSes. You could have a bike for every day of the month (don't forget the sidecar for winter).

this past weekend:

NY to NJ = 19.9 mpg
NJ to MD = 21.4 mpg
MD to VA = 23.6 mpg
VA to NJ = 25.6 mpg

The last leg I did the speed limit and used cruise control.

For the most part I looking for better milage on the commuting part.

The box (element) is doing fine so far, but the plan is to evaluate the situation in 4 months and see if a replacement is in order.

not really looking for "new car debt" but more using the right tool for the job.

Rev, After I total a car usally everyone comes for a ride in the rental.

Rock, before you throw your element away give me a shout, I always wanted one

As for replacement, if you must have 4WD get a Slobaru, new Impreza is under $20K

Jaeger wrote:[
Why not another Element?

--Jaeger

Discontinued about a year ago

wzm wrote:
A full sized truck would meet pretty much all your requirements, and with the right engine choice, some of them break 25mpg, have you thought about that?

Err, what? Exactly which full size truck gets 25 mpg, city or highway, with any engine? I know some of then are now rated at 20 highway, but that's a far cry from 25.

stiles wrote: Err, what? Exactly which full size truck gets 25 mpg, city or highway, with any engine? I know some of then are now rated at 20 highway, but that's a far cry from 25.

The F150 is rated at 23mpg with the V6, and next year's Ram 1500 is rated at 25mpg with the same.

wzm wrote:

stiles wrote: Err, what? Exactly which full size truck gets 25 mpg, city or highway, with any engine? I know some of then are now rated at 20 highway, but that's a far cry from 25.

The F150 is rated at 23mpg with the V6, and next year's Ram 1500 is rated at 25mpg with the same.

With 4WD?

What they "rated" and actual MPG are two different things

My Odyssey is rated 25, never seen more than 21, that is gently driving. Most times 17 mpg with 3.5L V-6

4 cylinder 2WD Toyota Tacoma will get 25+
Extra Cab makes it a reasonable transport

It's all moot. Mr. Rock finally came to his senses and bought a Scion iQ, despite my private insistance that he look at the Mistubishi iMiEV.