I haven't yet made my way entirely through it, but a lot of what these people have to say is very interesting.
I find Schank's ideas about schools and education particularly intriguing.
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Dangerous Ideas
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DerGolgo
- Zaphod's Zeitgeist
- Location: Potato
Dangerous Ideas
If there were absolutely anything to be afraid of, don't you think I would have worn pants?
I said I have a big stick.
I said I have a big stick.
-
liablemtl
- El Asbestos Pajamas
- Location: Portland
- Contact:
They've put some thought into writing their prose... but it reminds me of a Bad Religion song: A lot of big words to make the song seem smarter.
-
Photo
- Bacon Torpedo
- Location: Aurora, CO
I find Schank's ideas about schools and education particularly annoying. He proposes that schools should be abolished because they aren't effective. Well, he's living in a society built by its educated, responsible citizens - not by its idiots or its royalty, nor by its idiot royalty.
I heard that "don't need nothin' but readin' rytin' n' 'rith-ma-tick" nonsense from hand-to-mouth fools that populated the gutters of my childhood. I'd agree that academics aren't for everyone, but to use poor test results as an excuse to do away with publicly-funded education is lame.
Dropping our public education system re-creates class and caste systems that most of this country's ancestors fought to escape. Opportunity comes from education. If there is no affordable education available, there will be precious few opportunities for those of us born without the silver spoon in our mouths. Stupidity and laziness seem popular amongst the entitled rich of today's youth - but force these kids into a financial crisis and they will be thankful for all of that "unnecessary learning" they went through. Ignorance is expensive. When did anyone last enjoy great success from being uneducated? (Besides George Bush...)
I heard that "don't need nothin' but readin' rytin' n' 'rith-ma-tick" nonsense from hand-to-mouth fools that populated the gutters of my childhood. I'd agree that academics aren't for everyone, but to use poor test results as an excuse to do away with publicly-funded education is lame.
Dropping our public education system re-creates class and caste systems that most of this country's ancestors fought to escape. Opportunity comes from education. If there is no affordable education available, there will be precious few opportunities for those of us born without the silver spoon in our mouths. Stupidity and laziness seem popular amongst the entitled rich of today's youth - but force these kids into a financial crisis and they will be thankful for all of that "unnecessary learning" they went through. Ignorance is expensive. When did anyone last enjoy great success from being uneducated? (Besides George Bush...)
"Brought to you, by Carl's Jr."
-
DerGolgo
- Zaphod's Zeitgeist
- Location: Potato
True, that part of his statement sucks.Photo wrote:I find Schank's ideas about schools and education particularly annoying. He proposes that schools should be abolished because they aren't effective. Well, he's living in a society built by its educated, responsible citizens - not by its idiots or its royalty, nor by its idiot royalty.
I heard that "don't need nothin' but readin' rytin' n' 'rith-ma-tick" nonsense from hand-to-mouth fools that populated the gutters of my childhood. I'd agree that academics aren't for everyone, but to use poor test results as an excuse to do away with publicly-funded education is lame.
Dropping our public education system re-creates class and caste systems that most of this country's ancestors fought to escape. Opportunity comes from education. If there is no affordable education available, there will be precious few opportunities for those of us born without the silver spoon in our mouths. Stupidity and laziness seem popular amongst the entitled rich of today's youth - but force these kids into a financial crisis and they will be thankful for all of that "unnecessary learning" they went through. Ignorance is expensive. When did anyone last enjoy great success from being uneducated? (Besides George Bush...)
But the other bit, about making children want to learn instead of just filling their heads with stuff they will soon forget. That I found intriguing.
If there were absolutely anything to be afraid of, don't you think I would have worn pants?
I said I have a big stick.
I said I have a big stick.
-
Bigshankhank
- Fully Autonomous Cock-Puncher
- Location: Exiled to Living in a Van Down By The River
- Contact:
Well it seems to me the problem is when do you start educating them? At what point does a child come to the realization that education is a necessity for success? In my case, my 10 year old son (5th grade) hates school, not because he is stressed out at trying to please his teacher/peers, but because he is lazy and doesn't want to work hard. If this statement is to be followed;
according to Mr Schank I should find a school which would involve playing video games and watching Cartoon Network all day long. OK, so he's too young to make the decision about what he wants to do, so when does he start the education process? While I agree the current standardized testing system is a flawed abomination, the education he is recieving, quite against his will I might add, is providing the foundation for him to decide upon a path in his adult life. If a person at that particular crossroad in life fails to follow his instinct as to what he/she would enjoy and be successful at, then as an adult that individual has failed they own damn self.Their interests should guide their learning.
It's time for Humankind to ditch the imaginary friends of our species' childhood and grow the fuck up.
-Davros
"Lasse mich deine Seele dem Herrscher der Finsternis opfern"
Let me sacrifice your soul to the ruler of darkness
Always carry a bottle of whiskey when you travel in case of a snakebite. Futhermore, always carry a small snake.
-Davros
"Lasse mich deine Seele dem Herrscher der Finsternis opfern"
Let me sacrifice your soul to the ruler of darkness
Always carry a bottle of whiskey when you travel in case of a snakebite. Futhermore, always carry a small snake.
-
Ames
- Megachiroptera Übermench
- Location: Denver, CO in MY OWN DAMN HOUSE!
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It's this type of thinking that dooms the Libertarian party to mediocraty. I've been hearing this argument for years and it never gets any better. If there are problems with the American education system (and there are) then we need to figure out how to repair it and not abandon it.
As an educator, I see that one of the main problems is the overuse of standardized testing. In the school disctict where I live there are at least five standardized tests that are given every year. Five! It's worse in some other districts that I'm aware of. Why do we give so many tests? It's state and federally mandated. So educators are forced to teach to the tests and not actually provide the education that students need. Private schools aren't mandated to give as many standardized tests and are able to focus more on teaching the curriculum that the students need.
Why does this happen? Look at who is making the decisions for the schools, politicians. How many of these people have any experience as educators? Damn few! So, like bean-counters they feel that if they are able to demonstrate a significant number of statistics then they must be doing their jobs. They then mandate that certain tests be administered without reviewing how many other tests are being given.
Now think back to your time in public schools. How seriously did you take your SRA's? ITBS's? ASVAB.'s (some schools give them blanket to the students)? Probably about as seriously as students take the CSAP's, which is not very. Students think they're a waste of time that do little more than bolster the reputation of the school, but little for the individual (they're actually most effectively used by real estate agents to help potential home buyers "school shop" for their children). With no personal stake in the tests the students don't try to do as well as they could. Hence, poor test scores.
As far as personalizing education for the students, this is difficult to do without giving the teachers the lattitude they need to design more personalized curricula, which they can't do while under pressure to meet all the state and federal standards that are being forced on them.
I'm not against accountability for educators, I think that guidlines help us, but there's a difference between guidlines to help us and hamstringing us with bullshit test after bullshit test.
Welcome to my soapbox, hope you enjoy the view.
As an educator, I see that one of the main problems is the overuse of standardized testing. In the school disctict where I live there are at least five standardized tests that are given every year. Five! It's worse in some other districts that I'm aware of. Why do we give so many tests? It's state and federally mandated. So educators are forced to teach to the tests and not actually provide the education that students need. Private schools aren't mandated to give as many standardized tests and are able to focus more on teaching the curriculum that the students need.
Why does this happen? Look at who is making the decisions for the schools, politicians. How many of these people have any experience as educators? Damn few! So, like bean-counters they feel that if they are able to demonstrate a significant number of statistics then they must be doing their jobs. They then mandate that certain tests be administered without reviewing how many other tests are being given.
Now think back to your time in public schools. How seriously did you take your SRA's? ITBS's? ASVAB.'s (some schools give them blanket to the students)? Probably about as seriously as students take the CSAP's, which is not very. Students think they're a waste of time that do little more than bolster the reputation of the school, but little for the individual (they're actually most effectively used by real estate agents to help potential home buyers "school shop" for their children). With no personal stake in the tests the students don't try to do as well as they could. Hence, poor test scores.
As far as personalizing education for the students, this is difficult to do without giving the teachers the lattitude they need to design more personalized curricula, which they can't do while under pressure to meet all the state and federal standards that are being forced on them.
I'm not against accountability for educators, I think that guidlines help us, but there's a difference between guidlines to help us and hamstringing us with bullshit test after bullshit test.
Welcome to my soapbox, hope you enjoy the view.
Cheers,
Ames.
Whatever doesn't kill you, only makes you...stranger!
Quid Ita Serius?
You never know how much you appreciate your civil liberties until they've been violated.
Ames.
Whatever doesn't kill you, only makes you...stranger!
Quid Ita Serius?
You never know how much you appreciate your civil liberties until they've been violated.